More results for the possibility of Life on Mars - Page 17

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Kevin Author Profile Page



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PostPosted: February 8, 2012 6:15 AM 

A little humour, click on the photgraph in this link to enlarge. Perhaps this is the real truth about science papers!

http://fb.me/1owWflWfa

LWS


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PostPosted: February 8, 2012 8:06 PM 

Popular article on Lake Vostoc

[link] ?from=rss/&wpisrc=newsletter_slatest

Winston

Barsoomer


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PostPosted: February 9, 2012 12:34 PM 

http://www.astrobio.net/pressrelease/4071/desert-varnish-on-mars

Apologies if this has been posted previously. Note the shiny bluish color of the rocks in the image on the right.

Serpens


Posts: xxx

Reply: 324



PostPosted: February 9, 2012 10:47 PM 

The NASA press release referred to the weathering rind or overcoat of iron oxide which as they point out could mask the signature of carbonates. On Earth this is referred to as desert varnish (although manganese is a major componentand it can providecover for microbes and in some cases it seems that there may be biological mediation. In other cases there is no biological connection and biology is not necessary for this varnish to form. On Earth it is a product of transported material but on Mars this may not be the given the basaltic provenance of material.

Im not sure hhwat a 20 million year old lake could tell us about development of life. Now if it was 3 billion years old....

LWS


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PostPosted: February 10, 2012 8:26 AM 

Serpens; Are we only talking about development of life? Mightn't vostoc tell us a bit about survival of microbes under harsh conditions? Might'nt it also tell us something about any possible evolutionary changes in the vostoc microbiota over 20 million years as contrasted with similar organisms in other parts of the Earth?

It provides a laboratory where Science can study actual organisms in the lab using hard tools and not the now ubiquitous models that most likely have several holes in them.

Winston

Barsoomer


Posts: 344

Reply: 326



PostPosted: February 12, 2012 2:27 PM 

http://alliance.la.asu.edu/dorn/KrinsleyAstrobiology_09.pdf

Rock varnish in Tibet with discussion of possible relevance to Mars. The paper takes a neutral stance regarding biotic or abiotic mechanisms of production but discusses both.

Given that blackened rocks seem very prevalent on the eastern slope of Cape York (like Morris Hill), where I think the orbital signature of clay is concentrated, it seems very plausible that rock varnish is the source of the signature.

LWS


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Reply: 327



PostPosted: February 12, 2012 9:37 PM 

Barsoomer; I've been looking for the past 2 days or so for images of Rock Varnish spectra. So far I have'nt found any. They are all behind pay walls and I don't want to pay for a publication and then find it doesn't have such spectra. have you found any such spectra that can be used for comparison purposes?

Fwiw, I've also wondered if the blue and tan rocks could provide much of the clay signature at CY and have done a couple of crude spectra of some of these rocks and 2 spirit rocks that have similar looking dark blue/tan rocks. I'm just waiting until I locate some local rock varnish and clay spectra, for comparison, to post them.

The dark blue spectra seem to typically generally slope downwards over the 420 to 980 nm visual/IR range.

Winston

Barsoomer


Posts: 344

Reply: 328



PostPosted: February 13, 2012 12:10 AM 

Hi Winston, it is difficult to find such spectra. In

http://uu.academia.edu/IngeLoestenKate/Papers/1357223/An_AOTF-LDTOF_spectrometer_suite_for_in_situ_organic_detection_and_characterization

figure 10 gives a spectrum of rock varnish, but only above 1.5 microns.

Figure 2 in

http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2002/pdf/1046.pdf

gives reflectance insluding visible, but it seems to be for a reddish varnish, not a blue-black one, judging by the positive slope up to 1 micron.

I've been reading interesting stuff about manganese . Manganese, transmuted from iron by cosmic rays, is more abundant on Mars than on Earth. It plays an essential role in biology in helping organisms cope with superoxides. Manganese oxide seems to have versatile optical properties depending on the form. It can be pink as well as bluish-black.

John Henry Dough


Posts: xxx

Reply: 329



PostPosted: February 13, 2012 12:52 AM 

http://alliance.la.asu.edu/dorn/KrinsleyAstrobiology_09.pdf
This link ,,,that you posted above has some good stuff in it,I wanted to cut and post some of it here but got an error,a great ,interesting link,,thanks BS
j.
checking out this one now,,
http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2002/pdf/1046.pdf

This e-mail is mostly a test.
Thanks,,,don't feel for a second that the stuff posted is not read,,,most of it is read and Saved and read again.

LWS


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Reply: 330



PostPosted: February 13, 2012 5:25 PM 

Barsoomer; Thanks for the links!

I've added sol 2819 spectra for the blue region across the top of the gnomon to the stains comparison spectra.

Here it is:

Winston

Serpens


Posts: xxx

Reply: 331



PostPosted: February 13, 2012 8:21 PM 


Now this is an interesting hypothesis that makes a lot of sense with respect to a warm wet mars.
http://astrobio.net/exclusive/4552/baby-fat-on-the-young-sun

Kevin Author Profile Page



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Reply: 332



PostPosted: February 14, 2012 4:39 AM 

Hi Serpens, nice link, our Sun is a variable Star so we often have difficulty really pinning down what it has been through and what it will do next. We had four quiet years leading up to Solar Maximum and recently it has become very active!

Some also say that the Earth's atmosphere was much thinner 4.5 billion years ago and therefore allowed more heat in but of course lost it quite quickly. However the conditions were good enough for photosynthesis to take place and for life to develop in the Oceans and Seas, we still do not fully understand the magic off all of this.

What we need to really ask is Mars where it was 4 billion years ago? we know Planets such as Uranus and Neptune were much closer to the Sun before being flung out for whatever reason. That caused the Late Heavy Bombardment and our Moon is full of historical evidence for that. Was Mars closer to the Sun than it is now? Did Earth just get lucky acquiring a large Moon to stabilise it and prevent it being flung out too?

Ben


Posts: 2270

Reply: 333



PostPosted: February 14, 2012 1:22 PM 

These pictures of yogi rock show the same red dust coating on rocks as at CY ??
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=images+of+yogi+rock+on+mars&view=detail&id=EA0A065B4883217A2BC17E8862D28D03DFBF8287&first=0

Serpens


Posts: xxx

Reply: 334



PostPosted: February 14, 2012 6:26 PM 

Yeah all landers and orbital mesurements show that the dust is pretty much homogenous across Mars Ben. The magnetic phase has now been identied as magnetite.

Fred


Posts: 73

Reply: 335



PostPosted: February 14, 2012 6:41 PM 


Er... Global dust storms = Global dust. I know that is a lot to absorb but try. I have faith in the rock guys.....

LWS


Posts: 3062

Reply: 336



PostPosted: February 14, 2012 9:34 PM 

Two spectra I did a few days ago.

Rinds from sol 2164

Oppy homestake spectra

Spirit, Blue and Tan rocks.

Winston

LWS


Posts: 3062

Reply: 337



PostPosted: February 14, 2012 9:46 PM 

Disclaimer for the spectra that I have been posting.

User discretion is warranted. These spectra are crude figures intended only for discussion on this board and to try to show some differences or similarities between various areas in the Oppy pancam images used. They have not been spindled, mutilated or otherwise convolved or deconvolved. The accompanying spectra, taken from various sources on the net, are for comparison purposes only. It may be noticed that several of the oppy or spirit spectra are accompanied by an ice-water-earth vegetation spectra. This is because I have been unable, so far, to find any other spectra that can be compared with the downward sloping spectra typical of the blue/black patina on several of the CY or Greeley Haven blue rocks.

Winston

LWS


Posts: 3062

Reply: 338



PostPosted: February 17, 2012 9:59 AM 

This one is from Mars daily

[link]

Winston

Serpens


Posts: xxx

Reply: 339



PostPosted: February 17, 2012 4:26 PM 

Winston. Re your 337, what relationship does the illustrated spectra for vegetation and ice have to the pancam reflectance? The x axis scales are not in the same spectal bounds. ie 400 um = 4000 nm

Serpens


Posts: xxx

Reply: 340



PostPosted: February 17, 2012 4:28 PM 

that was 4 um - 4000 nm

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