Insight lander - Page 8

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Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 141

PostPosted: October 3, 2019 5:24 PM 

" testing by DLR suggested the issue was soil that clumps together rather than falling around the mole as it hammers. Sure enough, the arm's camera discovered that below the surface appears to be 2 to 4 inches (5 to 10 centimeters) of duricrust, a kind of cemented soil thicker than anything encountered on other Mars missions and different from the soil the mole was designed for."


While the statement gives an impression that the subsurface of fifteen feet depth might be loose particulates, the actual camera views show differently that there is a clumping type of material to the deepest evacuated levels seen thus far.
The HiRISE images I have prepared show a depth of material altered after emplacement at hundreds of meters thick, or, at least many tens of meters thick resulting in the thermal structure I was displaying in recent posts.
It would require destruction of the original subsurface for the 'soil'/regolith to be freed from original conditions.
Only time and testing will tell the story.
Some interesting information in the story.
Deposition of breccia and dust or original massive emplacement baking an altered semi-liquid material?
Success may yet be possible despite a massive localized structure still viewed at the surface.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 142

PostPosted: October 5, 2019 10:07 AM 

The 3X enlarged view of the IDC camera image shows a early morning sunlight angle which gives an entirely different perception of the adhesive 'droplets' on the cable, altered, and the continued showing of the scoop tip solid drift material.

image credits, originals; NASA/JPL-Caltech

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 143

PostPosted: October 6, 2019 2:49 PM 

Altering the early morning image of the scoop over the hole from the Sol 303 view, I have what appears to be in the shadow zone very thin frost markings on the inside of the scoop.
If this is really just a thin molecular cover of patterned frost of either water, hydrazine, or ammonia, possibly even CO2, it is difficult to view in the darkness.
It definitely does exist, but which chemistry and how much frost is present?
Possibly there is a finish to the scoop which causes the patterns to exist, or the patterns may help identify which chemistry is present.
I'll have to look at the later day timing views of the past two days to see if this is a late night phenomenon.

This material which follows the bright drift pattern coming from the soil on the scoop has been on the scoop for a week, therefore the drift and frost is in the soil on a stable basis, or, the frost is from the atmosphere and is absorbed or issued from an interaction with the atmosphere, or, possibly it is an activity in the soil which is ongoing and therefore much like respiration.
Respiring soil frost?

Sounds like what we are planning to look for in the '2020' mission and others.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 144

PostPosted: October 6, 2019 4:25 PM 

The most recent release image from Sol 305 shows the same 'vaporous' streaming upward drifting chemistry pattern of a detailed type all the way up the inner scoop surface, and is in the last views shown a 'yellow' tinted reflective material in the afternoon daylight. The sunlight is very yellow on Mars, the areas near the soil where soil shows strong drift movement is tending towards red near the soil, with most of the finer patterns tending yellow, and the scoop as a background is the red tending coloration. The pattern is brightened by the sunlight and is not simply a process of soil movement and deposition.

Sol 305, 3X at DPI 72. This is saturated color and altered considerably, from the third large crop view below. Here it is 200 pixels high so you can see the pattern without downloading the crops as some think my work isn't to be trusted from prior years comments made on the blog. A close look is still required at any altered view to see the vapor trails. Best to download the views and try looking at the originals in a photo editor yourself.

An afternoon look at the vapor trails, or vapor and fine dust entrained together.

Altered more with the 20 point color saturation increase.

Additional alteration of contrast and brightness, from which the slice of the scoop was taken.

If this is only a single change in the surface of the scoop, what is it, and can it be only fine particulate that are micron sized? If it is vapor and sub-resolved particles, why is it so entrained and patterned? Will cold do this without vapor causing the pattern and adhesion?

Is there something here to study? Is it only related to the landing chemistry?

They seem to have not used the hammer during this preparation for that work. Is this important or simply an expected situation not easy to see at the normal image size and settings?

Original on Sol 305

Image credits, originals; NASA/JPL-Caltech

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 145

PostPosted: October 6, 2019 4:49 PM 

I cannot see any entries after September 30 and reply 136, so here is yet a more altered version of the Sol 305 scoop view as from the original used in the prior post.
At what date would this pattern be changed from the current pattern seen? It clearly is related to the soil contacted by the scoop at work.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 146

PostPosted: October 7, 2019 2:46 PM 

Every day brings new intrigue to staring at the same objects in differing lighting and a change of distance and resolution.
On Sol 306 the newest view of the scoop on InSIGHT gives a view of an apparent circular screen with near but not quite regular patterned holes in the apparent surface of the screen face. As it is positioned very near the center recess of the scoop lip it is worth study as a object appearing from the assembly of dust or soil/regolith during the days of repeat viewing. Also this item seems to have 'holes' which are near to the pixel distancing but also not quite a match of the actual pixel spacing. A great check on illusion versus reality in enlarged views.
I have prepared a 3X crop enlarged with a 6X inset marked and labeled.
Reminds me of the day I found an SEM screen piece in a light microscope sample slide at 2,000 X enlargement embedded in the stained tissue.

The 6X as a stand-alone view.

The repeat views of the scoop and the metal cylinder hammer device are ongoing.

The wind on Mars is reaching 50 MPH and more.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 147

PostPosted: October 9, 2019 2:29 PM 

Sol 308, October 9, 2019, and the new scoop images are multiple in number returned, with a sample view here of the most recent full frame view. There are interesting changes in the inner scoop area with bright multiple colored clumps of material on the scoop mid-section. Waiting for a release of information about where they arose from and what they are.

At the lip of the scoop there are multiple repeats of an arc near the 'screen' shape original location, leading to the small rock at the ground surface in front of the hole. At the small rock there is a circle of clumps arranged on the background centered within the circumference of the rock but offset. All the details lead to questions about activity and content in sum. The lip has lost much of the content of dust/regolith and it apparently indicates the Hammer mechanism is being used to produce vibration and possible resonance patterns including disturbance of the fine grained material. Eventually I am fairly sure they will give animated GIF movies of the work underway.
I don't see much movement vertically of the metal tube, but it is worthy of a test GIF to find some of the answers while we watch.
Due to the unusual content I have done little to alter the views. I can produce those if the patterns are not seen well here.

Sol 308, 3X views at DPI 72, of the single last full frame released as of October 9, 2019.

The pattern on the scoop face may be connected to periodic vibration and resonant impulses from the hammer mechanism. As there was no release of information about the daily activity it was not discussed here by myself.

Source image, Sol 308,

Image credits, originals; NASA/JPL-Caltech

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 148

PostPosted: October 9, 2019 2:54 PM 

From the previous post, this is an initial highly altered view of the repeated arcs on both the scoop and the apparent ground surface, reduced to 16 tones and colors, showing better the directed movement indicated. ??

Haven't used this technique on the scoop face patterns as the 'yellow-green' pattern as it is more difficult and covers a range of tonal values.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 149

PostPosted: October 10, 2019 3:29 PM 

Continued efforts to use the scoop on the mobile arm to force the metal tube against the sidewall of the hole shows the motions are causing varied soil particles to appear, disappear, and group on the face of the scoop and the top of the scoop hinge area.
Day by day the loose particles are seen in various positions in shadow and daylight.
There must be some force applied as this grouping is not a previous daily process.

Sol 309, a view at 2X and DPI 72, cropped to allow a thumbnail view at 2X of both the section of the scoop hinge area on the left, and the scoop lip area on the right.
The left side crop is original unaltered settings, but the right side lip view is altered to show the shadowed bright particles in the indirect lighting on a dark surface. The scene is very different from the previous few days views.

A view unaltered at original size and settings with a 2X inset scoop view showing the full inner surface of the scoop bottom face. A couple of apparent particle clumps seem to exist this day on the mid-left wall near where the metal tube contacts the scoop wall, only one bright item where there were four or more the previous day in the near left side next to where the metal tube contacts the face, and now many small particles on the fore-face area where the original pile of 'soil' was deposited many days prior.
The crop here is 900 X 400.

Original image,

Original image credits; NASA/JPL-Caltech

I have noticed a very blurred view of the images on cell phones, let me know if it is continuous problem.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 150

PostPosted: October 10, 2019 5:06 PM 

Attempting to view the upper scoop 'splatter' pattern shows a multi-colored source of material which has streaking characteristics similar to the 'clumps' in the lower scoop face.
Are these a single source material and is the color from light interactions or a more complex process and multiple sources of materials?

This is 4X at DPI 72, with a left side view as the original enlargement, and the right side view as a XNView 'auto-corrected' color and contrast view. Worth a mare careful search for a source and explanation.

The image is 1280 x 396, so the thumbnail should be 2X plus.

If the materials are descending or 'splattering' from above or below why a semi-liquid or true liquid type source of colors?

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 151

PostPosted: October 11, 2019 11:09 AM 

Still receiving images for Sol 309 today, and a comparison of the Sol 306 versus the Sol 309 upper scoop mechanism rotation or 'elbow' area shows the graphic difference between a relatively clean dark surface and a liquid 'splatter' pattern on the same area.
This may be ongoing and repeated but I had not noticed a 'cleaning event' history on this surface. Possibly the Martian weather, landing chemistry, or Mars environmental difference from Earth has caused a leakage or loss of confinement of a lubricant. Also the possibility exists for a splatter from heavy arm stress from the pressure applied from the scoop against the HP3 metal tube mechanism. As this is an experiment in corrective procedure the applied pressure may have caused a seal breakdown or leakage slightly but not a complete breakdown.
A weeks images shows some activity associated with the scoop against the metal tube is timed with the various artifacts and liquid splatter.

A 4X cropped view of the upper scoop area without alteration other than enlargement.
Sol 306 on the left, Sol 309 on the right side. Even the labels are different with an 'over-splatter' pattern on the colored labels.

The thumbnail view again should be about 2X plus. The original was 100 pixels height and is shown here as 400 pixels height, thumbnail view online at about 240 pixels height. All images are downloadable and available. Al alterations are mine and are on the image texting at the image host if you run your mouse over the image name.

How much danger is there for a major seal blowout or scoop breakage in the procedure of hammering?

Image credits, originals; NASA/JPL-Caltech

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 152

PostPosted: October 11, 2019 12:07 PM 

This provides a context view of the vertical orientation of the Instrument Device Arm and the attached scoop applied against the HP3 metal tubular device.
There is some interesting splatter of an apparent liquid content travelling downward from the arm. The appearance is that there is a strong directional pattern applied either from the prevailing wind or from a directional force, possibly simply gravity and vibration or leakage of a pressurized sealed lubricated bearing/bushing item, forcing the material onto the dark upper body face of the scoop used against the metal tube.
This is a 1 to 1 view of the early morning scene from a ICC view on Sol 309. The scoop position with the splatter directional orientation seems to come from the immediate area, but the open question is whether there could be a higher elevation source or some weather source not seen previously.
The weather has been dropping a few degrees to below -150 F minimum and the wind blowing in the early morning to mid-day at 35 to 45 MPH maximum most days.
The weather influence could be significant as the weeks pass.

Original full frame view link.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 153

PostPosted: October 13, 2019 1:55 PM 

Sol 312 and the metal tube device appears to be possibly lower in the position of depth relative the soil surface. It may be there has been there were other movements causing the appearance to change but motion has redistributed the particles on the scoop areas, and most all the soil on the scoop lip is now on the ground below the scoop lip. Many particles are along the top of the scoop shape, not now appearing liquid but as loose objects in appearance.

The scoop on two days, the last is Sol 312.
The second image is at same size with the right side closeup at 2X. It should appear about 1/2X and same size in the thumbnail.
The enlarged view is altered.

A notice as to how much hammering has been done may be released soon.

Sol 312.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 154

PostPosted: October 13, 2019 4:45 PM 

The angle of view and distance between the camera and scoop-ground has changed between Sol 303 and Sol 312. That difference seems to dominate the scene in estimating whether there has been a change of depth for the HP3 metal tube penetration. There is an impression of greater depth due to the angle used on Sol 312. The motion of particles and the cleaning of he scoop lip indicates substantial vibration or force applied. Without a close angle match or large depth change a comparison is not easy to judge.
View on the right is altered to show new particles on scoop body.

2X at DPI 72.

Image credits, originals; NASA/JPL-Caltech

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 155

PostPosted: October 14, 2019 5:44 PM 

It is now Sol 314, no new images since the last post, and the DLR HP3 blog has an entry from October 7, 2019 defining an electronics problem and a plan to use the hammer a maximum of 20 strokes to try the 'pinning' technique.
As that number may have been reached thus far, the consequence of the effort may not be a successful plan to solution. I see nearly no downward motion as yet as of Sol 312.
The work has cleaned the scoop lip and added dust type spots in various places on the scoop body, but even the 'liquid' appearing spots seem to be the total effect of the work.
I suspect that the multiple solid layers are far deeper than the team has discussed.
Waiting for an acknowledgement of the work done.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 156

PostPosted: October 17, 2019 11:32 AM 

After testing the system of adding side pressure to the tube, there may be success showing in the days image returns. No advisement on the number of strokes performed but the tube seems to be lower on the scoop today.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 157

PostPosted: October 17, 2019 11:48 AM 

The popular science news groups have acknowledged the progress today, but no new blog releases as yet from DLR.


Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 158

PostPosted: October 17, 2019 5:04 PM 

No time as yet to try a photo editor view of the newest HiRISE image of Insight. This a quick phone version crop of the lander.

Don't know which size this will display from android app restrictions and lack of size options. Seems to be a very good source for equipment details. 160 miles distant.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 159

PostPosted: October 17, 2019 6:13 PM 

A direct JPG may work with Android-Image Shack.

Dana Johnson

Posts: 1195

Reply: 160

PostPosted: October 18, 2019 2:43 PM 

On Sol 316 a new image of the metal tube in position was taken giving a comparison of the slight change of elevation but again from a slight change in angle of view which may be accenting the impression of the movement.
This is a view of Sol 312 and Sol 316 at 2X enlargement. The view is about 1 to 1 on the blog I believe. The dust or particle clumps are in motion between dates for many and the ground around the metal tube is oddly not apparently altered significantly. For a penetration without gross hole edge alteration is good news I am sure, but the movement between dates is very great a change in perspective to the scoop and background.

A larger crop view at 2X.

Original Sol 316 source image.

I'll be working on a detailed view of the lander from the HiRISE image. The arm with shadow is visible, possibly even the MOLE housing or other large rocks and deck instruments.
Source image for posts #158 and #159.

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