What will it take for MRB to become relevant again?

Author Message
LWS







PostPosted: December 9, 2016 11:35 PM 

The glory days of MRB were somewhere between 2004 and 2008 when several posters carefully examined every image coming from the Mars Rovers and interpreted them in differing but highly educational ways. Those were the heydays of HortonHeardaWho and Jamdix and Mann and Scidude and Barsoomer and Serpens and of many others who contributed regularly and discussed exhaustively all the news about Mars as well as the MER images.

Those days are now long gone. I suspect that the ennui of having seen it all before and the fact of no definitive new information on life on Mars has ensured that the energy evinced by posters in the early days would not continue so that is why I ask; Is there anything new that, given all we've seen coming from the MERS and from Curi, can bring back some energy and interest in the MRB forum?

Is there something that is being hinted at in the images that are now being taken and the research that is being done that gives some hope that there might be a breakthrough in the research in the relatively near future?

I think there is and I think it will involve the contributions that Kye and myself and Barsoomer and AZ-Dave and a few others have been concentrating on over the past couple of years. That is the work that now seems to be evident that is going on around the mini debris flows and "soil" movements and that are increasingly being studied by Curi.

I suspect that this area holds the key to a demonstration that life exists in association with that phenomenon. Microbial life that is not totally different to ours on Earth but which has made itself known in structures that mimic stromatolites as well as in the anomalous nature of the flows around and on individual rocks.

Any takers in this very speculative discussion?

Winston

Faceless


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PostPosted: December 10, 2016 3:24 AM 

Scientists: Traces of Organic Macromolecules Found on Mars
[link]

edi


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PostPosted: December 10, 2016 10:34 AM 

The problem is the forum needs desperately, an update. Its vuleranble to disgusting Scat prostitute hindu spam and has alot of wierdo's on it.


Also, Mars has gotten boring to the public.

Mauree


Posts: xxx

Reply: 3



PostPosted: December 10, 2016 6:12 PM 

Edi has a point - it's hard to post and the engine is definitely outdated. I still come for the content and the scientific insights of people like Winston, etc. However, having a modern blog/forum will improve visibility imho. Even a simple Facebook page may be better than this.

Yes, we would lose a lot of history in switching to something new, but we can still refer to this blog for that.

LWS


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PostPosted: December 14, 2016 7:58 AM 

Faceless, EDI and Mauree;

Thanks for the valuable input.

Meanwhile perhaps the impetus might come from this news

[link]

But I take the point that the vehicle probably needs upgrading and Facebook or some other method might be best to enhance the conversation.

Re. the organics findings; What that says loud and clear is that Gil Levin was right. Organics are almost omnipresent on Mars surface... and so might be Life.

Winston

Faceless


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PostPosted: December 14, 2016 8:57 AM 

Eigenbrode said:"I am convinced that organics are all over Mars,". That was a huge amount of organics. Meteorites cannot be the single source of all the organics all over Mars.

LWS


Posts: xxx

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PostPosted: December 14, 2016 10:07 AM 

Faceless;

A number of us over the years have been beating the drums for the current existence of microbial life on mars. The new information on the likely ubiquity of organics, taken along with the RSL evidence so far, drives the nail in the alternate but dominant theory that Mars has no surface water and, even if it has transient water, such miniscule water could not have supported life because an oxidising surface has ensured that such organics cannot exist on the surface as demonstrated by the various rovers which have not found complex organics on Mars.

This news is extremely important as it removes that faux narrative and leaves open the possibility that there is widespread occurence of life on or near the Martian surface.

I was not aware of the recent findings when I wrote the first post of this discussion but it was precisely the possibility that we were nearing such a revelation that impelled me to write it.

I think that many previous frequent posters left MRB in disgust as nothing definitive re. life on Mars seemed to be coming to the fore and so the interest in this topic has waned. Perhaps it will not come back again until the new research can demonstrate signs of extant or past life and perhaps even then it will not come back.

But I think that a concerted study of the rock forms that resemble stromatolites and the green textured surfaces on some rocks in certain environments at Gale might bear some fruit in this regard. The martian stromatolites would be one feature that could show eventually that life on Mars is there and not too dissimilar to microbial life on Earth. I can appreciate the reality of planetary protection will cause reasearch in this area to be hastened slowly but I think that the difficulties must be studied and resolved and solutions factored into future research.

Winston

Faceless


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Reply: 7



PostPosted: December 14, 2016 10:36 AM 

In addition to organics all over Mars, Curiosity rover also discovered macromolecules.
https://www.inverse.com/article/25001-organics-mars-nasa-scientists-optimistic-alien-life

Non-biological processes have nothing to do with macromolecules, which usually contain thousands of atoms. There is not a single inorganic mineral that contains thousands of atoms. Only life can form macromolecules.
That discovery means life, present or past, has been discovered on Mars.

LWS


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PostPosted: December 14, 2016 5:24 PM 

Faceless;

Yes!

Winston

Dana Johnson


Posts: 1195

Reply: 9



PostPosted: January 17, 2017 12:51 PM 

As usual, all I can offer is an observation from the Wolton program EQ3d, an Earth based observation, that the source, cause, and relationship between Earth movement, 'earthquakes', and flowing water are clearly interrelated, in detailed ways. If you take a screen capture or watch the one week quake pattern across the USA this past seven days, 1/17/2017, there are a dozen small quakes near large rivers, and half are in the off course loops where rivers change course then return to the same basic path. The greatest number are again in Oklahoma where I live, showing a continuous 'fill in' of the river passage across Oklahoma and Kansas where the course change stops following the Oklahoma Aulacogen-Basin pattern diagonally northwest to southeast. This is a debated question area where human activity has started frequent quakes small to medium in the thousands the past few years. Stopping human activity has slowed quakes, but residual liquid and change left activity post shutdown of liquid chemical dumping. While the distances to some quakes are significant from rivers, the pattern is real, and often involves the erosion patterns as well as the deeper heat sources for the geology activity aiding erosion and elevation changes.
If we were to look for organics on Mars it would be smart to have mapped the surface sufficiently to know where and when the water and heat flowed and mixed.
Hopefully we will see the continuation of INSIGHT and other missions to Mars to give a broader base of searching for the best landing sites. The suggestive character of shapes is never enough, and new missions should give better chemistry results.
Hope this blog and the few others give some public interest in the study of Mars rather than a languishing disinterest.
Curiously the dozen quakes are the total sum other than the California active tectonics group this past week yet again. It is a common occurrence, caused to be more noticed as it enhanced by humans causing earthquakes aided by the local geology predisposition apparently.
Lets hope our new president can see, study, and learn the value of both human and natural science activity in coordination.
Try the program, we might make looking for Mars evidence better by applying results to the study of geology on Mars.
The tablet I am using today prevents taking a screenshot of the earthquake3d program results.
2017

Dana Johnson


Posts: 1195

Reply: 10



PostPosted: January 17, 2017 12:58 PM 

As usual, all I can offer is an observation from the Wolton program EQ3d, an Earth based observation, that the source, cause, and relationship between Earth movement, 'earthquakes', and flowing water are clearly interrelated, in detailed ways. If you take a screen capture or watch the one week quake pattern across the USA this past seven days, 1/17/2017, there are a dozen small quakes near large rivers, and half are in the off course loops where rivers change course then return to the same basic path. The greatest number are again in Oklahoma where I live, showing a continuous 'fill in' of the river passage across Oklahoma and Kansas where the course change stops following along the Oklahoma Aulacogen-Basin pattern diagonally northwest to southeast. This is a debated question area where human activity has started frequent quakes small to medium in the thousands the past few years. Stopping human activity has slowed quakes, but residual liquid and change left activity post shutdown of liquid chemical dumping. While the distances to some quakes are significant from rivers, the pattern is real, and often involves the erosion patterns as well as the deeper heat sources for the geology activity aiding erosion and elevation changes.
If we were to look for organics on Mars it would be smart to have mapped the surface sufficiently to know where and when the water and heat flowed and mixed.
Hopefully we will see the continuation of INSIGHT and other missions to Mars to give a broader base of searching for the best landing sites. The suggestive character of shapes is never enough, and new missions should give better chemistry results.
Hope this blog and the few others give some public interest in the study of Mars rather than a languishing disinterest.
Curiously the dozen quakes are the total sum other than the California active tectonics group this past week yet again. It is a common occurrence, caused to be more noticed as it enhanced by humans causing earthquakes aided by the local geology predisposition apparently.
Lets hope our new president can see, study, and learn the value of both human and natural science activity in coordination.
Try the program, we might make looking for Mars evidence better by applying results to the study of geology on Mars.
The tablet I am using today prevents taking a screenshot of the earthquake3d program results.
2017
I am not getting a posting acknowledgement again.

LWS


Posts: xxx

Reply: 11



PostPosted: January 17, 2017 4:29 PM 

Dana;

Type [&refresh] and then press enter (without the square brackets) then press the refresh icon.

Winston

Dana Johnson


Posts: 1195

Reply: 12



PostPosted: January 21, 2017 12:02 AM 

Thanks, LWS, I'll try that, this is Win 8.1, but I need to study the tablet details further. Perhaps we should assemble a dozen contributors and start a 'habitat' one year torture test-study like this one in Hawaii?
That should add some drama to the posts, and would help keep individuals focused.

[link]

Transportation,,, and life support on Mars certainly will be a challenge, and faceless is posed or transposed to indicate to us the degree of difficulty in a manned mission.
China may be there first if President Trump slows the commitment. Let us take life here and there seriously. These rovers are doing a substantial part of the required science, but the technology is as slow as the mission projects.
I still think we should have a single topic list of just suggestive close up images for the casual public who cannot watch all images.




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