Solander Point - Page 15

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Paul Scott Anderson

Posts: 53

Reply: 281

PostPosted: January 14, 2014 4:35 PM 

From Mike Seibert's twitter:

"Today is my second RP shadow shift and first with IDD. We are planing an off axis APXS placement on Pinnacle Island."


Posts: xxx

Reply: 282

PostPosted: January 14, 2014 8:50 PM 

Stan, Hort can explain better, but the infrared radiation emitted by a "warm" body has much much longer wave length than the ones detected by those cams.

To emit radiation at the wavelength in Hort cams (abt 1 micron) the temp would have to be in the thousands on Celsius.
That's why that's the reflected sunlight .

Infrared cams works in wavelengths hundreds of times bigger.


Posts: 344

Reply: 283

PostPosted: January 14, 2014 10:17 PM 

We've seen overturned sods before, but have not investigated them. In stereo, the above scene seems to have interesting white almost worm-like features.


Posts: 344

Reply: 284

PostPosted: January 14, 2014 10:35 PM 

Another disturbed area. Did the rover passing nearby cause a leak?


Posts: 344

Reply: 285

PostPosted: January 14, 2014 10:41 PM 

Sure looks like there was once intense water action here. A confluence of two streams forming a muddy delta, with the water ponding in the lower area and overflowing to form a smaller stream below.


Posts: 344

Reply: 286

PostPosted: January 14, 2014 10:46 PM 

This was meant for reply 283.


Posts: 344

Reply: 287

PostPosted: January 15, 2014 10:42 PM 

Stereo closeup of a disturbed area.

Looks like there is soil, not rock, under the dry crust.

Paul Scott Anderson

Posts: 53

Reply: 288

PostPosted: January 17, 2014 8:21 PM 

Squyres talked about Pinnacle Island at the Opportunity: 10 Years on Mars event yesterday. He thinks it unlikely to be from a nearby impact, and the initial analysis of the dark area in the middle shows high amounts of sulfur, magnesium and manganese.

Video link here:

Bill Harris

Posts: 3

Reply: 289

PostPosted: January 17, 2014 9:54 PM 

Yep, it's almost as though someone tippy-toed in and dropped an odd rock near Oppy to get 'em stirred up. But we know that couldn't happen, right? Wink



Posts: xxx

Reply: 290

PostPosted: January 19, 2014 9:51 AM 

Sol 3541 3545 3550 (Jan 9-13-18, 2014 ) registered, averaged and sharpened view of a metal splash behind the sundial on Cook Haven:

Perhaps I am over sensitive to strange features...

There appears to be a metallic "splash" on a rock just behind and left of the sundial.

I think the bright beads on the edge of the splat are "real" and are the result of something like this:


Posts: xxx

Reply: 291

PostPosted: January 19, 2014 4:38 PM 

I found a second piece of Curiosity's EDL plastic which blew all the way to Solander Point and crawled under the rock that appeared out of nowhere:

I'm crazy for thinking it's anything but plastic, though. It's obviously just a piece of plastic.



Posts: xxx

Reply: 292

PostPosted: January 19, 2014 4:43 PM 

Try it again:

I found a second piece of Curiosity's EDL plastic which blew all the way to Solander Point and crawled under the rock that appeared out of nowhere:

I'm crazy for thinking it's anything but plastic, though. It's obviously just a piece of plastic.

Bill Harris

Posts: 3

Reply: 293

PostPosted: January 20, 2014 1:51 AM 

"There appears to be a metallic "splash" on a rock..."

Why do you characterize it as "metallic"? It doesn't appear to be much different than other wind-polished impact melt clasts we've seen. It'd be definitive to be able to view it with a polarizing filter.



Posts: xxx

Reply: 294

PostPosted: January 21, 2014 2:08 PM 

Sol 3541 3551 ( Jan 9-19, 2014 ) infrared false color of the changes to pinnacle rock, Cook Haven:

The R3 and R5 filters are missing and the lighting is slightly different - but I *think* I see a subtle dimming in the infrared of the dark area inside the rock.

I will redo when all the data is available.

Assuming that the infrared dimming is "real" what processes could be responsible for the dimming within a week???

Bill, I read the bright spots on the edge of the "splat" as specular reflections from beads of splashed material. Anyway, that's what I see...


Posts: 37

Reply: 295

PostPosted: January 23, 2014 1:35 AM 

If there is a "dimming" on the IR end of the spectrum that has occurred over the last 10 sols that is not contributed to lighting difference then you should be able measure that by measuring the difference between the grayscale IR and Red bands.

One possible process is the rapid breakdown of carbonate by intense UV radiation.


Posts: 37

Reply: 296

PostPosted: January 23, 2014 2:04 AM 

The sampled area:

The math:

and the results:

I would have to agree with you, and call me crazy, but I don't think this is plastic.


Posts: 344

Reply: 297

PostPosted: January 23, 2014 11:36 AM 

I think the dark stuff is covering the white stuff. So it may be the transparency of the dark stuff that is varying over the IR wavelengths, rather than the reflectance.

In that case, the change may be due to a change in the transparency (an increase?). Or maybe the dark stuff is powdery and is just blowing away now that it is exposed.


Posts: 37

Reply: 298

PostPosted: January 23, 2014 12:13 PM 

The "dark stuff", or jelly as Squyres calls it,is sulfur, magnesium and manganese as Mr. Anderson points out in #288 above. With the absence of any radiometric corrected images yet, at least available publicly, a spectral analysis of the "white stuff" will have to wait. However, I would guess that there is a good chance that it's a carbonate due to the high albedo.

The short IR measured by the right pancam ccds is also reflected EM radiation, just as the natural color is, so would expect there to be some variance across the entire spectral range measured by the right ccds.

Removal by wind is just as plausible but the lack of a heavy atmosphere increases UV rads at the surface leading to rapid decay of the chemistry.

"In order to achieve these goals, Mars exploration spacecraft will visit sites where we may expect to find sedimentary rocks containing evidence of biologically-important minerals (such as carbonates, sulfates, phosphates) and preserved organic compounds. (Note that organic molecules are rapidly destroyed at the surface of Mars today by the intense ultraviolet light from the Sun -- light that, on Earth, is filtered out by our ozone layer). Mars exploration may even lead to the discovery of a fossil record of past microbial life." (Dr. Cabrol)


Posts: xxx

Reply: 299

PostPosted: January 23, 2014 2:46 PM 

Sol 3541 3554 infrared false color comparison of pinnacle rock, Cook Haven:


I no longer see any infrared changes in the dark stuff.

In order to compare the two sols, I adjusted the brightness and contrast of the 3554 filters individually to match the same area of rock in the lower part of the frame for the sol 3541 filters.

The assumption was that that area did NOT change between the two sols and thus could serve as an exposure "control".

There are some surprising ( to me ) differences between the images - but NOT in the area of interest.

The changes are best seen in this PNG animation that is best viewed with Firefox.

The only hope is that the radiometrically calibrated 12 bit original lossless images do show a measurable change.

But it may be some years before some lowly undergrad student in geophysics writes a homework assignment on the problem - at Oppy U in Endeavour City.


Posts: xxx

Reply: 300

PostPosted: January 23, 2014 3:54 PM 


Sometimes you just have to do the numbers...

Ala happyfish, I sampled the brightness in three areas: Dark soil, Bright rock and Jelly and computed average brightness ratios B/A ( before and after )

ALL of the filters for bright rock had ratios of 1.01.

ALL of the filters for dark soil had ratios of 0.97

BUT the ratios for the jelly were:

R2 1.20 ( dimmed 20% )
R4 1.08 ( dimmed 8% )
R6 1.04 ( dimmed 4% )
R7 1.01 ( dimmed 1% )

THEREFORE, the jelly darkening was real - especially in the R2 filter - but the enhanced difference processing ( 8x differences ) saturated the RGB images and thus hid the effect! ( too much of a good thing. )

So, to summarize There in fact was a time dependent effect in the infrared spectrum of the jelly.

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