The Stain - Page 10

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Barsoomer


Posts: 344

Reply: 181



PostPosted: March 16, 2011 2:11 PM 

Horton's #178 casts doubt on the vibration hypothesis, but let's say for the sake of argument that a decrease in the stain might possibly be due to some red dust being blown over it. I think it would clinch the case against vibration if a significant _increase_ in the stain could be shown to occur while the rover was stationary.

Psych, thanks for restoring the stain movie. Maybe it can be used to compile a list of Sols on which significant stain changes were noticed, which could then be compared to the list of drive sols.

Psych Author Profile Page



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Reply: 182



PostPosted: March 18, 2011 10:24 AM 

The wide angle L2 images.


Wide angle L6 images
.

Wide angle L7 images.

The stain starts @ 1:18 in all of them.

dx


Posts: 1661

Reply: 183



PostPosted: March 18, 2011 2:21 PM 

Psych>>>

Thank you for those 3 gifs...good work indeed.

This 'stuff' sure is creepy!!!

I'll watch those gifs several more times to see if I can put any thoughts together.

yt
dx

Psych Author Profile Page



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Reply: 184



PostPosted: March 18, 2011 10:44 PM 

Your welcome for the moving pictures.

Referencing my post 145 about how the stain is dark in all filters except the UV. Being an auto mechanic by trade, I didn't understand what I was 'seeing' through the filters. But, in a black and white image, I could see the lighter parts and my brain said those parts are lit up. I could see the dark parts and my brain would say those things are dark, either they are in shade or, they are just 'dark'. So just what was a filter 'seeing' since I could 'see' everything in the image. I felt there was more to this filter business so I dug into it a little further.

Now I know that the 'white' areas are places where Electromagnetic Radiation at the frequency of the filter have passed through and hit the detector. Dark areas are where all other wavelengths of ER have been blocked.

I learned IR was slow and had something to do with temperature and UV was so energetic it usually causes some things to fluoresce.

So, the stain is dark in all the filters. It is not reflecting very much light at any of the wavelengths the rover can detect. Thats not good. We see it because it is dark. Not because it is reflective. We see it because it is blocking or absorbing most of every wavelength the rover can see.

Near IR is a measure of warmth, not necessarily HOT heat as thats the domain of far infrared. Dark in the near infrared, it is not radiating any detectable NIR nor does it appear to be reflecting any, it could be very cold. I fairly sure it is much colder than the surrounding deck which by the decks lightness is reflecting\radiating some NIR. I wonder what the stain would look like to the mini-tes? That might be just the data the doctor needs. Too bad its not working.

Transparent in the UV. Not sure if it is actually transparent in that what we are seeing is UV passing through it then being reflected off the deck or, is it reflecting UV at the same level as the deck?

Psych Author Profile Page



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Reply: 185



PostPosted: March 19, 2011 7:33 PM 

FYI: While the total time of the sundial observations versus the total time on Mars is extremely small, Opportunitys sundial has been the most observed science target on the surface of Mars to date, next to the sun.

We don't have 16,000+ images of Wopmay... Laughing

Psych Author Profile Page



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Reply: 186



PostPosted: March 19, 2011 7:34 PM 

Oops, the solar observations would actually be from the surface of Mars.

Barsoomer


Posts: 344

Reply: 187



PostPosted: March 19, 2011 11:02 PM 

Psych, is it possible to view your animation as a slide show? Just the part that contains the stain. That would make it easier to pin down exactly when the significant changes occurred. Were they all sudden, with periods of quiescence in between, or were there gradual progressive changes? Thanks.

Barsoomer


Posts: 344

Reply: 188



PostPosted: March 20, 2011 12:41 AM 

Here's a noticeable change that took place while the rover was stationary on Sol 2031. The first image is at 11:19 Mars Time, the second at 13:56.

hortonheardawho


Posts: 3465

Reply: 189



PostPosted: March 20, 2011 8:58 AM 

sol 2031 ( Oct 10, 2009 ) animation of lighting changes:

I think the all differences are due entirely to the lighting change and image "noise".

I used original 12 bit data and adjusted the exposure so that the area around the stain had the same brightness.

I also did a square root brightness adjustment to emphasize shadow details and a translation alignment to, er, align the images.

The images are 4X so you can see pixel artifacts associated with a number of image noise sources - including CCD pixel errors, CCD noise and compression errors.

Both of these images were part of a full filter sequence so that a better image can be created - but I don't think it would show any "real" changes to the stain.

Barsooomer, here are my flickr images tagged with the keywords Opportunity and sundial. You may use the Flickr "slideshow" link to view them as a slideshow.

Again, I ask for volunteers to tag my Flickr image set with interesting keywords.

But who will help me eat the bread the little red hen said.

Psych Author Profile Page



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Reply: 190



PostPosted: March 20, 2011 11:09 PM 

@ Barsoomer, slide shows are what they essentially are, with a .5 second display time. I was hoping that pausing them and using the jog bar would work for stepping through them.

Sol 2024 has a set of Sundials, one taken at 11:04:31 LTST with no stain and one taken at 12:36:12 LTST showing the beginning of the second appearance of the stain at the rear corner of the sundial. One can tell by the ground behind the sundial the the rover moved between images.

Psych Author Profile Page



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Reply: 191



PostPosted: March 20, 2011 11:34 PM 

PS to the post thats stuck in link limbo.

From the MER mission archive "On Sol 2024, Opportunity turned around with a 2-meter drive to face the meteorite." (Shelter Island).

The first appearance of the stain on 1621, was after a drive across 10m of sandy soil on a 17 degree slope while exiting Victoria. The sundial was last imaged on sol 1618 during that drive and was clean then. Three sols later the stain was at the rear of the sundial.

So, motion of the rover may indeed play a role in the stains 'movement'. Whether it's due to just changing the direction the wind blows across the deck is another mystery.

Barsoomer


Posts: 344

Reply: 192



PostPosted: March 21, 2011 1:44 AM 

Thanks Psych and Horton, but what I need is a slideshow of a progression of images of the stain in chronolological order so I can identify a tight range of sols in which each significant change took place. I would then try to refine the range using both navcams and pancams. The slideshow linked in 189 has a huge jumble of images in no particular order. I find the jog bar too awkward to work with in the youtube animation.

It does seem that most if not all of the significant increases have taken place during drives; it is at least not easy to find a counterexample The attitude (slant) of the rover might also be a factor because of gravity. The stain particles have always seemed too heavy or sticky to be moved by the wind.

Barsoomer


Posts: 344

Reply: 193



PostPosted: March 21, 2011 1:50 AM 

> ... increases have taken place during drives

I meant to say "... increases are noticeable after drives." We don't know they occurred during the drive. Many of the sundial images are separated by gaps of several sols during which drives took places.

Ben


Posts: 2270

Reply: 194



PostPosted: March 21, 2011 6:50 PM 

The sun-dial appears to be attached by 4 screws-bolts (one on each side). Is it possible there is a thin void space between it and the surface below that would allow material to collect under the plate and then spill out under the right tilt or vibration?

Psych Author Profile Page



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Reply: 195



PostPosted: March 21, 2011 11:47 PM 

I see in Hortons view of the fresh sundial, it is indeed anchored to 'pads' in the surface of the deck. There also appears to be a gap between the base and the deck. I presume the pads would be slightly higher than the deck to prevent uneven pressure from being applied to the surface of deck from the base of the sundial. From [link] I learned there are 6 home-plate shaped cutouts in the bottom of the base to lighten the sundial. These could possibly harbor large pockets of fine dust that gets shaken out from under the sundial. Only question then would be, why not out from under the other edges? Maybe it has to do with the orientation of the cutouts?

dx


Posts: 1661

Reply: 196



PostPosted: March 22, 2011 12:15 AM 

folks>>>

Open the .jpg pic and investigate the whole solar panel as Oppy photographed itself when it landed 7.2 years ago.

http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA07372

I wanted to see if there were any other instruments around the dial that may have 'leaked' oil-but I consider that all bearings are sealed units-besides I see nothing that would cause a leak on the deck of Oppy.

yt
dx

dx


Posts: 1661

Reply: 197



PostPosted: March 22, 2011 12:19 AM 

fault>>>Oppy was on Mars for almost a year-to my 195.

yt
dx

hortonheardawho


Posts: 3465

Reply: 198



PostPosted: March 22, 2011 11:21 AM 

sol 2532-2544 ( Mar 9-21, 2011 ) 3D montage of changes near the sundial:

with a link to the 3D animation.

The changes are consistent with a wind blowing from the right. I wonder if there was a power bump last week?

Psych Author Profile Page



Posts: no

Reply: 199



PostPosted: March 23, 2011 8:45 PM 

Looks like the gnomen is returning to its original gold color, a lot of the black paint has been blasted off it. I'm really surprised it has stayed black for so long!

Ben


Posts: 2270

Reply: 200



PostPosted: March 24, 2011 6:47 PM 

Psych; What is that black paint composed of?
Could it be material making up the stain?

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